You must sign in to post. | etiquette question: what's a "truce"? :: Jan 30, 2007 @ 7:51pm |
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 thirdparty
Joined: Dec 20, 2006
Posts: 279
Location: Eastern U.S.A. | Two stories:
1- The other day I was playing a game where another player and I agreed to a truce (I was a refugee, but had too many ships for it to be worth exterminating me, so long as I was not a threat); he was a serious contender for the win, but not actually in the lead). About a minute later, the strategic situation had changed: he appeared to be gaining dominance. I wrote "I regret that I must withdraw from the truce in ten seconds", waited ten seconds, and then attacked his rear. As it turned out, he didn't notice the message, and furthermore I was wrong about him being dominant; both of us were killed as the guy he had been fighting unearthed some reserves and swept the field. My former ally was furious, delcaring truces with me to be worthless. It had not been my intention to do anything underhanded, and I do value my honor, so this rather ruined my evening.
2- Today, I made a truce with a player about my size (I think it was the same player, actually--I can't keep track of all these multiple handles everone has) as we launched a joint attack on the player who controlled over half the field. After a while, the situation began to draw toward each of us having a third of the map, and I noticed my ally's ships starting to attack my planets; seeing myself under attack by both players, I retreated all my ships to a corner. My former ally objected that the leader would win if I withdrew; I pointed out that he was the one who had ended the truce and that my only chance without allies was to let the two of them fight it out. His response was astounding; he redoubled his attack on the leader, whereupon I followed suit. Ultimately, the leader was defeated, whereupon my ally surrendered to me despite the fact that he was larger and could easily win; he felt he owed it to me for breaking truce.
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I find this kind of thing confusing. I feel like a barbaric crusader playing Galcon against Suleiman the Magnificent. When I make a pact with another player during FFA, I think of it as a short-term agreement. Yes, it's underhanded to agree to a truce and then immediately attack the person when he, trusting the truce, launches against someone else or starts grabbing neutrals. But I don't expect the peace to last the whole game (how could it, in a free-for-all where only one player can be the winner?), only until the situation changes. I assume the truce to be over once the empire we're allied against starts to crumble, and I also consider myself free to end the truce earlier as long as I give some warning (like "I regret that a truce is no longer in my interests; I withdraw" or "I consider that neutral planet to be mine, turn around or else").
What do other people think? How big a commitment are agreements with other players? | | Re: etiquette question: what's a "truce"? :: Jan 30, 2007 @ 9:34pm |
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philhassey 
Joined: Nov 30, 2006
Posts: 761
Location: Zarcon | I tend to see truces as valid for as long as the situation remains the same.
Usually I don't mention them, but someone else asks me for one and I agree. And generally, I see them as a way of saying "Okay for the next minute we'll agree not to in-fight, we're going after the big guy. But once the big guy is no longer dominant, the truce is out and we can fight again, or do whatever seems convenient." | | Re: etiquette question: what's a "truce"? :: Jan 31, 2007 @ 3:20pm |
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nfp Joined: Dec 30, 2006
Posts: 55
Location: Czech republic, Brno | ye but if the guy has bad (long) name he can easily mise the message you write.
that is the main reason why i want TAB completing ;-) | | Re: etiquette question: what's a "truce"? :: Feb 4, 2007 @ 8:19pm |
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 carn
Joined: Dec 16, 2006
Posts: 74
Location: LA | I believe I am the player in both of Thirdparty's stories. I may have been under another name -- goober, or ryth or rythelas or something.
As to the first story, I was mostly just really annoyed that you had misread the situation. I had been doing my best to seem big and powerful against someone twice my size in troops and apparently it was enough to convince thirdparty. So I was annoyed that we had a Truce for what I assumed was until I or he was winning but then it ended resulting in the opposing player's win. I was just mad that thirdparty made a bad decision.
As to the second story, I thought my best decision was to attack thirdparty at a crucial moment when his troops were elsewhere so I could gain some strength and sweep the map. Unfortunately, that depended on thirdparty actually continuing to fight. The alternative, him turtling, and giving every one of his planets to the enemy was a very sure way for me to lose, and him too. So I had three choices. 1) wait and lose. 2) Attack thirdparty and really lose. 3) All out immediate war against the other player, and lose. So since all I could do was lose I figured I might as well apologize for breaking the treaty and thus causing my inescapable defeat.
Treaties work like this: If you aren't good at upholding them then people won't make them with you. Which might be fine. Of course, sometimes they'll be forced to anyway. I find the best strategy is this: With newbies make very clear treaties. Like, 'truce against white until he has 3 planets' for instance. or '2 minute ceasefire' (ceasefire is a good word. People tend not to hold it against you later when you break it.) With good players i just say truce because they know they'll lose otherwise. And I expect them to break it the moment they can and win. If they can't win and they break it, or if espsecially if breaking it ensures their loss, then I hold it against them. | | Re: etiquette question: what's a "truce"? :: Feb 4, 2007 @ 10:22pm |
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thirdparty
Joined: Dec 20, 2006
Posts: 279
Location: Eastern U.S.A. | carn: your version of the stories makes sense except for one detail: why'd you surrender to me in the second game?
By the way, I notice that people are focusing on only one type of truce: the truce against a larger player. An equally important one is the truce at the start for picking up neutrals: when two players are close enough together, and the planets around them so expensive, that neither can grow without the other jumping on him. In these situations it's useful to agree not to attack each other while both grow.
Unfortunately, "I expect them to break it the moment they can and win" doesn't work in this case--they can break it instantly and win. | | Re: etiquette question: what's a "truce"? :: Feb 4, 2007 @ 10:27pm |
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carn Joined: Dec 16, 2006
Posts: 74
Location: LA | The surrendering was this -- I had far fewer troops than you may have realized. | | Re: etiquette question: what's a "truce"? :: Feb 12, 2007 @ 5:09am |
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becephalus 
Joined: Jan 19, 2007
Posts: 130
Location: St. Paul, Minnesota | My truces are not worth the text they are displayed on. they will only be hnored insofar as I deem it in my interest. You have been warned :)
There is no honor in interstellar genocidal warfare, only victory! | | Re: etiquette question: what's a "truce"? :: May 15, 2007 @ 9:13pm |
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rafsoaken Joined: May 14, 2007
Posts: 16 | my two cents again:
"let's not suicide" is usually a good way to truce without actually having one. It works well for grabbing neutrals and if backstabbers are near. |
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